Utopia Talk / Politics / more Witch Hunt! indictments

tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 11:27:38 Special counsel Robert Mueller has obtained a new indictment charging 12 Russian intelligence officers with hacking Democrats during the 2016 presidential election, and stealing information about 500,000 American voters, the Justice Department announced Friday. The indictment lodged in Washington, D.C., accuses the Russian spies of hacking into the Democratic National Committee and the presidential campaign of Hillary Clinton, and of releasing emails obtained from that cybersnooping with a a goal of influencing the election. The accused also hacked into state boards of elections, secretaries of state, and into companies that provided software used to adminster elections, according to Deputy Attorney Rod Rosenstein. ... "The indictment charges 11 of the defendants with conspiracy to commit computer crimes, eight counts of aggravated identity theft, and conspiracy to launder money. Two defendants are charged with a separate conspiracy to commit computer crimes," Mueller's office said. http://www...telligence-officers-with-.html
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 11:33:30 Trump defenders: this doesn't implicate Trump so it's still fine for him to call it a Witch Hunt!, keep smearing the DoJ & trying to get it shut down
Im better then you 2012 UP Football Champ	Fri Jul 13 11:34:23 I'm sure Trump will confront Putin about this.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 11:59:46 this is what the idiot child said at a press conference about bringing up the meddling w/ Putin: “I don't think you'll have any ‘Gee, I did it, I did it, you got me'... There won't be a Perry Mason here, I don't think, but you never know what happens, right? but I will absolutely, firmly ask the question” he doesn't even understand he's supposed to be troubled by it, & not simply accept Putin's denial
Pillz Member	Fri Jul 13 12:02:38 I'm not sure why you're crying
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 12:04:14 if that's at me, you'll have to expound
Average Ameriacn Member	Fri Jul 13 12:13:33 Putin will agree to total denucularization and that make you liberals all shut up.
Paramount Member	Fri Jul 13 14:54:06 ”The indictment lodged in Washington, D.C., accuses the Russian spies of hacking into the Democratic National Committee and the presidential campaign of Hillary Clinton, and of releasing emails obtained from that cybersnooping with a a goal of influencing the election. ” Don’t forget that Trump went on national TV and called on Russia to hack Clinton and release her emails. He actually told a long time ”enemy” or opponent of the US to attack the US, on TV. It shouldn’t be difficult for the police and the prosecutors to put Trump in jail for the rest of his life.
kargen Member	Fri Jul 13 15:10:27 The indictment says the hacking began in March and continued from there. President Trump made his comment saying maybe the Russians can find the deleted Emails in late July. They began releasing E-mails in June. President Trump would have been aware of those releases leading to his off the cuff statement in July.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 15:26:26 from indictment: "The conspirators spearphished individuals affiliated with the Clinton campaign through the summer of 2016. For example, on or about July 27, 2016, the conspirators attempted after hours to spearphish for the first time email accounts at a domain hosted by a third-party provider and used by Clinton’s personal office. At or around the same time, they also targeted seventy-six email addresses at the domain for the Clinton campaign." fun fact: July 27 is the date Trump gave the hacking order to his collusion partners maybe bumbling idiot Trump is actually the leader of Russia... like the Jar-Jar Binks being a sith lord theory
Paramount Member	Fri Jul 13 15:28:54 Don’t know where u got that info from, because: Russians Targeted Clinton’s “Personal Office” On Same Day Trump Called on Russia to Find Her Personal Emails, Indictment Says http://sla...-asked-russia-to-hack-her.html The Same Day Trump Called for Russia to Hack Clinton's Emails, They ... Hacked Her Emails http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a22142188/rod-rosenstein-indictment-russia-hack-collusion/ Russians went after Hillary emails same day Trump called for hack http://nypost.com/2018/07/13/russians-went-after-hillary-emails-same-day-trump-called-for-hack/ Lock him up.
American Democrat Member	Fri Jul 13 15:29:11 "The indictment says the hacking began in March and continued from there. President Trump made his comment saying maybe the Russians can find the deleted Emails in late July. " Which is highly inappropriate to endorse. "On July 27, 2016, Donald Trump denied Russia was the likely culprit in the email hacks, but also announced, “Russia, if you’re listening, I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing. I think that you’ll be rewarded mightily by our press.” "They began releasing E-mails in June. President Trump would have been aware of those releases leading to his off the cuff statement in July. " http://www...ler-email-hackings-dnc-clinton
Paramount Member	Fri Jul 13 15:29:31 @kargen
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 15:40:21 here's Trump speaking today about our relationship w/ Russia (before latest indictments were public, but Trump had been briefed earlier this week on them) " I think that we're being hurt very badly by the — I would call it the witch hunt. I would call it the rigged witch hunt after watching some of the little clips. I didn't get to watch too much, because I'm here, it's a different time zone to, put it mildly. But after watching the people — the man that was testifying yesterday, I call it the rigged witch hunt. I think that really hurts our country, and it really hurts our relationship with Russia. I think that we would have a chance to have a very good relationship with Russia, and a very good chance — very good relationship with president Putin. I would hope so. " (he's referencing Peter Strzok testimony which was a disgrace by R's :p... there remains nothing suggesting Strzok acted corruptly to create a fake investigation into the President as if even possible) so... the relationship is soured by the witch hunt... that keeps catching witches... he couldn't care less about the actual actions of Russia (& these are intelligence officers, obviously known to Putin, not random 400-lb fat citizens)
kargen Member	Fri Jul 13 15:46:18 From the indictment "For example, beginning on or about March 15, 2016, YERMAKOV ran a technical query for the DNC’s internet protocol configurations to identify connected devices. On or about the same day, YERMAKOV searched for open-source information about the DNC network, the Democratic Party, and Hillary Clinton. On or about April 7, 2016, YERMAKOV ran a technical query for the DCCC’s internet protocol configurations to identify connected devices. 24. By in or around April 2016, within days ofYERMAKOV’s searches regarding the DCCC, the Conspirators hacked into the DCCC computer network. Once they gained access, they installed and managed different types of malware to explore the DCCC network and steal data. a. On or about April 12, 2016, the Conspirators used the stolen credentials of a DCCC Employee (“DCCC Employee 1”) to access the DCCC network. DCCC Employee 1 had received a spearphishing email from the Conspirators on or about April 6, 2016, and entered her password after clicking on the link. Between in or aroundApril 2016 and June 2016, the Conspirators installed multiple versions oftheir X-Agent malware on at least ten DCCC computers, which allowed them to monitor individual employees’ computer activity, steal passwords, and maintain access to the DCCC network." @Paramount that is where I got it from. The actual indictment. " “Russia, if you’re listening, I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 [Hillary Clinton] emails that are missing,” Trump said at a July 27, 2016, press conference. “I think you will probably be rewarded mightily by our press. Let’s see if that happens. That will be next."" So tell me where President Trump told them to hack E-mail accounts. We know from the indictment that E-mails were made public in June. We knew (was highly sure) they came from Russian hacking. President Trump would know this. It is extremely likely President Trump was referring to the already hacked E-mails and saying the Russians should look through them for the deleted E-mails. His farther comments about the press rewarding him is a snide comment about the press and their support for Hillary. It was an off the cuff comment on things that had already happened.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 15:51:34 he's obviously asking them to hack... why would he ask Russians specifically to simply review material already available to anyone? although none of this particularly relevant, Trump's crimes are yet to be revealed
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 15:54:52 the conclusions that should be drawn: Trump is totally unfit for office (for continuing to call this a witch hunt, smearing the DoJ, trying to shut it down,etc... plus his mysterious inexplicable love & continual defense of Russia... plus numerous other character defects... like inability to speak the truth, inability to learn anything about issues, continuous childish behavior)
Paramount Member	Fri Jul 13 15:57:04 Kargen, Well, how would they find the emails if not hacking into the system? And even if Russians did some queries in March, maybe the actual hacking started after Trump called on them to find the emails and leak them.
American Democrat Member	Fri Jul 13 15:57:05 "So tell me where President Trump told them to hack E-mail accounts. We know from the indictment that E-mails were made public in June. We knew (was highly sure) they came from Russian hacking. President Trump would know this. It is extremely likely President Trump was referring to the already hacked E-mails and saying the Russians should look through them for the deleted E-mails. His farther comments about the press rewarding him is a snide comment about the press and their support for Hillary. It was an off the cuff comment on things that had already happened. " So you find it appropriately to endorse a foreign government to interfere, or to attack our institution and fellow American Citizens. Sounds like exactly that Trump did and you are perpetuating it. Was that appropriate or not, Kargen?
kargen Member	Fri Jul 13 16:10:40 "he's obviously asking them to hack..." Hack what? The E-mails were on a private server and were removed in 2015. There actually was nothing to hack in regards to the missing E-mails. "maybe the actual hacking started after Trump called on them to find the emails and leak them." So they released hacked E-mails in June that they didn't hack until late July? That is a damn nice trick. I don't think it was appropriate. I've said many times I am not a fan of the way President Trump does things. That aside I recognize a joke when I hear one. You know it was a joke because he continued on to say Russia would be rewarded by the press for exposing Hillary. We all know the press for the most part might as well of been a part of her campaign.
American Democrat Member	Fri Jul 13 16:14:39 Joke or not. That isn't something to say nor encourage which coincidentally supports the timeline of what transpired. You are aware that even attempts starting back then, does not negate the very fact that more attempts were made around that time again when Trump Jr. met some Russian associates and then Trump making those remarks, and then another action took place. Not saying it is related, but could be. Which gives the appearance and that is something that should not be done.
Paramount Member	Fri Jul 13 16:17:35 There are some rumors now that Trump may seek political asylum in Russia because of the witch hunt in America. But he is probably only trying to avoid the risk of being jailed.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 16:31:07 " Hack what? The E-mails were on a private server and were removed in 2015. There actually was nothing to hack in regards to the missing E-mails. " as if Trump knows anything about servers, hacking or emails... i doubt he could find Twitter using a computer... Trump supports crime when it benefits him, there's no question about it (hack emails, beat up protesters, murder Hillary...) but again to the point... how is Trump fit for office in light of his response to this? (& every other thing he's ever said or done... it's so ridiculous)
swordtail Anarchist Prime	Fri Jul 13 16:31:53 http://en....unt#Figurative_use_of_the_term
kargen Member	Fri Jul 13 17:25:12 "which coincidentally supports the timeline of what transpired." No it does not. The E-mails were hacked months prior and released a month prior. That is the timeline according to the indictment. Might also be time to point out the indictment says "on or around July 27" so those in this thread saying the indictment claims both happened on the same day is false even if we didn't have all the prior activity. "You are aware that even attempts starting back then, does not negate the very fact that more attempts were made around that time again when Trump Jr. met some Russian associates and then Trump making those remarks, and then another action took place." Yes I am aware. Are you aware that the indictment says the activity continued through November. So no matter when that summer President Trump made his statement it could be shown to coincide with Russian activity even if completely unrelated. Again I agree, stupid thing to say. Just like his interview he did with the Sun was stupid. He had to know they were not going to portray him in a positive way. But he is who he is. "as if Trump knows anything about servers, hacking or emails..." He commented on it. That should be your first clue that he might have known. He doesn't have to know how to hack a server to comment on a server that was hacked.
kargen Member	Fri Jul 13 17:38:34 Reading farther into the indictment: "On or about June 22, 2016, Organization 1 sent a private message to Guccifer 2.0 to “[s]end any new material [stolen from the DNC] here for us to review and it will 17 have a much higher impact than what you are doing.” On or about July 6, 2016, Organization 1 added, “if you have anything hillary related we want it in the next tvveo [sic] days prefable [sic] because the DNC [Democratic National Convention] is approaching and she will solidify bernie supporters behind her after.” The Conspirators responded, “ck . . . i see.” Organization 1 explained, “we think trump has only a 25% chance of winning against hillary . . . so conflict between bemie and hillary is interesting.” b. After failed attempts to transfer the stolen documents starting in late June 2016, on or about July 14, 2016, the Conspirators, posing as Guccifer 2.0, sent Organization 1 an email with an attachment titled “wk dnc linkl.txt.gpg.” The Conspirators explained to Organization 1 that the encrypted file contained instructions on how to access an online archive of stolen DNC documents. On or about July 18, 2016, Organization 1 confirmed it had “the 1Gb or so archive” and would make a release of the stolen documents “this week.”" So that shows there was a planned release of E-mails on or around the time President Trump made his statement weeks prior to the statement. And just personal opinion here but I think the Russian efforts were made with them assuming Hillary was going to win the election and they wanted to undermine her presidency. Since the election their efforts have gone into undermining President Trump and unfortunately he is unable to see this.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 17:39:33 why would the indictment specifically note July 27th if nothing remarkable happened? and you seemed to suggest Trump would know the server wasn't available to be hacked... i'm saying he's a total idiot who wouldn't be able to absorb or understand such info... just like when people say firing Comey wouldn't end the investigation so 'obviously' that wasn't Trump's intent... idiot Trump would have no such knowledge (he even stated to the Russians that the pressure was off after the firing)... also why are you avoiding how this is more solid proof of his unfitness? (STILL smearing the investigation & NO criticism of Russia over this... EVER)
kargen Member	Fri Jul 13 18:54:58 "why would the indictment specifically note July 27th if nothing remarkable happened?" It said on or about the 27th. Just like it said on or about a whole lot of dates in April, May, June, July, August, September and October.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 19:01:45 do you really believe the numerous (77) new Hillary targets occurring 'around' then were not related to his comment? you don't need her server if you get the opposite end of the conversation Trump requested Russians commit crimes to help him & they heeded the call... although we already knew he did that, now we know people listened now to the present, let's focus on how he needs impeached or 25th'd immediately
kargen Member	Fri Jul 13 20:07:41 What I believe doesn't matter. What does matter is there is nothing in the report indicating that is what took place. Let us go back and look at President Trumps comments. It will be fun for me and enlightening for you. “I will tell you this, Russia: If you’re listening, I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing, I think you will probably be rewarded mightily by our press.” “If Russia or any other country or person has Hillary Clinton's 33,000 illegally deleted emails, perhaps they should share them with the FBI!,” Same day. “To be clear, Mr. Trump did not call on, or invite, Russia or anyone else to hack Hillary Clinton’s e-mails today,” he wrote in a series of tweets. “Trump was clearly saying that if Russia or others have Clinton’s 33,000 illegally deleted emails, they should share them.” Look at the 2nd quote really close. Do you see these three words " has Hillary Clinton's"? Now look at those three words and concentrate on the first one. "has" HAS: possess, own, or hold. Meaning if you have the E-mails release them. Back to the original quote. The Emails were leaked on July 21st a Friday. It hit the major news outlets Monday July 24th and remained a featured story the rest of the week. That president Trump was commenting on what was the leading news story that week is much more plausible than any explanation saying he called for Russia to hack and they responded same day. If you read the indictment you will see for several months agencies here would discover and close a vulnerability followed by Russia amping up efforts to find another vulnerability. That scenario fits the July 27 timeline better than thinking the Russians reacted to something President Trump said.
hood Member	Fri Jul 13 20:11:53 Handlers trying to cover for Trump's stupid comments != Trump saying things.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 20:29:12 are you suggesting Trump enlisting criminals to sift more thoroughly through their ill gotten gains is much better than asking them to commit further crimes? also, forget all of the July 27th stufff... find him a single time having a shred of negative reaction toward Russia for the meddling... we have them hacking election systems and he says nothing... nothing... just that the 'witch hunt' is hurting his ability to become fuck buddies with Putin
kargen Member	Fri Jul 13 21:14:59 again not suggesting anything. I am saying there is nothing in the report linking what President Trump said to Russian actions. There is zero evidence Russia reacted to President Trumps comments. The follow up comment by President Trump does go a long ways towards the scenario I offered up as being what actually happened. You realize that now so have taken to trying to deflect the argument a new direction. And if President Trump were even half as stupid as you think he is how could he have possibly known about hacking E-mails if it were not the hot story in the news?
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 21:34:58 the July 27th bit has never been my main problem in this thread (although I do believe his encouragement led to action) it was inappropriate when he said it, and remains so his reaction is the main problem at hand, he does not care... at all... it is more important to him to protect the notion that his win was fully legitimate without help, to insist that the investigation is a hoax even though no one in the intel community has agreed and we keep finding criminals, and then there's whatever has caused him to be Russia defender and friend since he started his campaign
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 22:37:22 long ago we got: 'nobody knows for sure', 'could be some 400 lb guy in his bedroom'... after unanimous conclusion by intel agencies, we got: 'it was only 4 of 17 agencies' (ignoring only 4 would be tasked to investigate), 'the intel agencies messed up w/ WMDs', 'Russia's so talented, if they did it, we'd never know' all this based on NO contradictory evidence he accepted Putin's denial last meeting he has countless smears of 'hoax' & 'witch hunt' (including his repeated nonsensical claim about it being a Dem excuse for losing election even though started beforehand) just 2 weeks ago he again tweeted doubt Russia did anything plus what he said TODAY (in above Fri Jul 13 15:40:21 post) after KNOWING about these indictments there is clear evidence of Russia meddling, & there is clear reason for team Trump to be investigated (both Russian indictment groups include Americans being involved just supposedly unaware, plus Trump Jr 'lets collude' meeting, Page/Papadopolous/Manafort/Stone/Flynn meetings/connections,etc & Trump's constant defense of all things Russia) how can anyone defend this shit from this shit president...
tumbleweed the wanderer	Fri Jul 13 23:18:07 Sean Hannity's take: "Why announce these indictments today, on the eve of this meeting between the president and Vladimir Putin? To me this timing is suspect." http://twitter.com/FoxNews/status/1017955591552143361 which Fox News felt was insightful enough to make into a tweet to all their followers... reminding the world that Russia is a bad actor is somehow sneaky & inappropriate right before their lead idiot defender meets with them... if anything this helps Trump not make a total fool of himself by again just accepting Putin's denial... but he probably still will... cause he's an unfit stubborn idiot
American Democrat Member	Sat Jul 14 06:13:02 "I am saying there is nothing in the report linking what President Trump said to Russian actions. There is zero evidence Russia reacted to President Trumps comments. The follow up comment by President Trump does go a long ways towards the scenario I offered up as being what actually happened. You realize that now so have taken to trying to deflect the argument a new direction. " If you are unable to see that Trump comments cannot be seen as an 'enabler' to provoke, to endorse, to give a positive move to take some sort of action, then this is where you are being an apologist and care not for any objectivity. I know you are trying to spin it as that Trump did not specifically say; "hey Russian hackers do this." But it is as equal when it is said "I hope you find those." Both statements enable, infer, and promote and action to be taken. Yes, hacking, and not just for emails were taking place for sometime. And not just the DNC, RNC, the Pentagon, state levels, local levels, etc were being target by a Russian campaign. But the moment Trump became an enabler, despite how you want to spin it, and spare me what you think cannot be connected, but it is coincidental, it can be concluded that Trump had some influence, due to his highly inappropriateness of when this particular event occurred as it was an uptick; 4. Russian hackers targeted Clinton emails the same day Trump called for them to find "missing" emails. On July 27, 2016, Trump said during a campaign event, "Russia, if you're listening, I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing," referring to emails Clinton deleted from her server because she said they were personal. According to the indictment, that same day, Russians "attempted after hours to spearphish for the first time email accounts at a domain hosted by a third party server used by Clinton's personal office." That is a fact. And that is suspicious. The other specifications didn't talk about trying to find "Clinton Emails" it described the actions taken by the hackers to find information by getting on the network to seek various information across the board, and it may as well been about emails. But it wasn't specifically targeted for Clinton's emails until then. I know you will again attempt to spin this. I know you will also make the claim Trump didn't tell them to do that. But that statement he made can definitely be construed for them to take some sort of action.
swordtail Anarchist Prime	Mon Jul 16 10:20:50 ROBERT MUELLER REPLACES US CONSTITUTION WITH ROYAL LETTRE DE CACHET – COUNTER-INTELLIGENCE OPERATION AS DUE PROCESS http://joh...ion-as-due-process/#more-19500
swordtail Anarchist Prime	Tue Jul 17 09:05:22 Jeffrey Carr‏ @jeffreycarr Follow Follow @jeffreycarr  More GRU Covert Election Fuckery TTPs: 1/ use known RU threat actors 2/ use known RU malware, 3/ use RU companies for attack infrastructure 4/ open a stolen document on a work computer named Iron Felix 5/ launch your own website "Covert" is GRU's middle name. #MuellerIndictment 3:45 PM - 16 Jul 2018
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