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Utopia Talk / Politics / Game of Thrones:The Queens Justice
Im better then you
2012 UP Football Champ
Sun Jul 30 02:10:13
Last episode Tyrion tells a plan so massively retarded that the Sand Snakes like it. Cause Tyrion "Demon Monkey father murder" Lannister is the Public Relations master. Tyrion then claims Jon Snow a good guy cause he spent some time with him at the wall and thats good enough for Dany even though Tyrion is well known for being a horrible judge of character. No one asks Theon his opinion of Jon Snow they just grew up together which is a shame cause now he's Reek again. Then Arya is so fucked up she is rejected by her own dog. My dog literally did flips and danced on hind legs when I was gone a day or two but even after years if you smell like Frey pie, old man mask, and Ed Shirren dogs will just look at you in disgust and walkaway.

In this episode Dany holds Court. Cersei returns a gimp. Jamie learns his mistakes and Grey Worm dies. In 1hr and 3mins of violence and nudity

Renzo Marquez
Member
Sun Jul 30 05:03:18
For this episode, over/under on number of Dornish women raped by the Mountain is 1.5. Cersei will bring up Elia Martell beforehand too.
obaminated
Member
Sun Jul 30 13:56:51
Yeah i have a feeling something horrible is gonna happen to Tyene in front of ellaria, most likely the mountain was raping the girl while the mom slowly cooks alive.

Also, tyrions plan is pretty solid. The dothraki are a total liability and would cause the entire country to turn on her.
Im better then you
2012 UP Football Champ
Sun Jul 30 14:24:02
1)Casterly Rock is on the other side of the continent with no easy way to get there from Dragonstone.

2)Starving the capitol into submission is much worse than rape.

3)They've lost the element of surprise. Cersai knows about the dragons and developing counter measures. If they had just shown up with 3 dragons the Lannister army would've shit themselves and ran away.
Pillz
Member
Sun Jul 30 14:27:55
Danny's invasion is over before it began. Her story goes North.
Forwyn
Member
Sun Jul 30 14:49:04
Yeah, HBO has taken great liberty with the teleportation of Unsullied across Westeros to Casterly Rock. They would be taking the same route as the convoy to Dorne.

North, possible, but it's completely unmapped and would take a great deal of time.
obaminated
Member
Sun Jul 30 15:22:27
They could theoretically sail into the riverlands and beach near the golden tooth which would be a shorter march to casterly rock. I used to play the got mod for ck2 a lot.

But yes, tyrions convoy of unsullied would otherwise have been with yaras fleet. Or maybe different ships = different speeds?
obaminated
Member
Sun Jul 30 15:24:18
Tyrions whole point is to win on both a political and physical level. War fare they have an easy hand. But ruling after conquering with dothraki is going to be nearly impossible because every lord is going to hate the fact that their peasants are going to be raped by foreigners. We are seeing the reach turn on Dany.
Cherub Cow
Member
Sun Jul 30 16:03:25
[Im better then you]: "No one asks Theon his opinion of Jon Snow they just grew up together"

lol.. good point actually :D

..
I'm guessing Samwise Gamgee is going to be kicked out of the citadel? Trainees can't just disobey the head maester, can they? Stealing books was one thing, but if Jorah survived then there would be pretty obvious evidence. Or if Jorah lived then maybe Samwise will be given his first chain-link for 'mastering' grey-scale?
obaminated
Member
Sun Jul 30 16:10:21
I think it'll be the classic "what you did was wrong but you did it so well we will reward you" trope for samwell.
chen
Member
Sun Jul 30 17:57:03
"Tyrions whole point is to win on both a political and physical level. War fare they have an easy hand. But ruling after conquering with dothraki is going to be nearly impossible because every lord is going to hate the fact that their peasants are going to be raped by foreigners. We are seeing the reach turn on Dany."

Eh, the lords are bitches anyway. They'll just follow whoever they fear the most. I mean the Boltons killed a bunch of the Northerner's kin, and no one bothered helping Jon.

Logistically, the Dothraki post-war are a liability as there's zero chance they'll become an agrarian population. They'll have to be sent back to Essos. But for the war they are still incredibly useful to win quick which is what matters.
Pillz
Member
Sun Jul 30 18:53:22
So since this started with 5 kings and were down to 1 King and 2 queens, how long until Sansa replaces Jon and makes Got the most progressive show of 2017?
obaminated
Member
Sun Jul 30 18:57:19
The fact that there are so many female leaders doesn't really bother me because all of them, except Dany, have had to overcome obstacles to get to where they are. Dany just has plot armor and dragons. It's why her story sucks in the books and the show. Everyone else has to balance ruling by appeasing various factions, everyone on her side is unquestionably loyal and never plots.
obaminated
Member
Sun Jul 30 21:05:57
Easily the best episode of game of thrones
hood
Member
Sun Jul 30 21:34:11
That old Tyrell hag has stones.
Pillz
Member
Sun Jul 30 22:02:12
"Everyone else has to balance ruling by appeasing various factions, everyone on her side is unquestionably loyal and never plots."

Pretty sure she's been betrayed by allies before although nothing like the Starks getting fucked by their bannermen or Theon. But yeah plot armor has saved Danny from stuff since the Starks get fucked in ever direction every time...
obaminated
Member
Sun Jul 30 22:40:30
Jon and Dany are definitely gonna bone. And why is Dany, mother of dragons, gonna have a hard time believing in ice demons?
Cherub Cow
Member
Mon Jul 31 00:57:41
[Pillz]: "how long until Sansa replaces Jon and makes Got the most progressive show of 2017?"

Given that Littlefinger wants to kill Jon before Jon can return and reclaim power from Sansa... pretty soon?

..
[obaminated]: "everyone on her side is unquestionably loyal and never plots."

Tell that to the Sons of the Harpy! ;)
But yeah, she's always had loyal people who kill the disloyal peeps (like how Drogo killed one of his own blood riders for opposing Danny, or how Jorah did the same (killed a blood rider) when Danny was letting the witch use dark magic to "heal" Drogo).

..
[obaminated]: "Easily the best episode of game of thrones"

lol wut? :D
*This* episode? This was sort of a transition episode. Cersei's scene and Olenna's scene were strong, but there have been far more important episodes than this one — and many of them.

..
Looks like the bank is a factor again! The bank has been another kind of Littlefinger for the show: heavily involved but flying under the radar. Cersei handled that well.

Bran is already totes Jaded. He better keep some things in perspective or he'll be as useless an idea as a "God".

They really could have slowed some things down. Jon arrives between episodes and Jorah is already healed enough to put a shirt on? HBO must be excited to purge this expense.

Funny how Olenna drank the poison and then confessed once she thought that made her safe, but that was kind of a gamble. If Jaime had thought much more about it, he probably would have brutalized her before the poison took her..
hood
Member
Mon Jul 31 07:35:39
Jaime isn't the monster Lannister and he never has been. He's been careless, heartless, vapid, but never an actual monster.
Rugian
Member
Mon Jul 31 09:28:16
The whole series started with him trying to murder a child. He's definitely become a better person since then, but he definitely did some monstrous shit early on.
Rugian
Member
Mon Jul 31 09:35:09
Also, I found it amusing that the only person who has been happy with Cersei nuking the Faith Militant so far is a banker who holds slaving interests and engaged in wartime speculation by financing both sides of the conflict. The High Sparrow truly was the biggest hero on the show.
Rugian
Member
Mon Jul 31 09:41:41
And as Alex Jones would point out, the fact that the viewing audience is actively siding with the banks and despots against a genuine champion of the common people just goes to show how deeply you mindless peons have accepted your conditioning. WAKE UP SHEEPLE
hood
Member
Mon Jul 31 10:40:38
"The whole series started with him trying to murder a child."

He wasn't a monster for that. It wasn't malice, he didn't take perverted pleasure in trying to murder Bran. A careless asshole, certainly. But you cannot compare him to cersei or Ramsay.
Aeros
Member
Mon Jul 31 11:22:42
Euron certainly has some Deus ex Machina going on though. You can tell we are no longer in the areas where Martin has written. Dany certainly had to have some set backs in order to make her desperate enough to not throw Jon Snow into the dungeon, but the way they did it was with Euron's magically teleporting ships who happen to always be in the right place at the right time, and are somehow able to wipe out entire fleets without taking significant casualties.

Definitely lacks Martin's flare for the dramatic turnabout.
Rugian
Member
Mon Jul 31 11:43:23
What, are you not buying Euron's ability to drop off prisoners in Kings Landing, sail all the way around Westeros and lay siege to Casterly Rock in the space of half an episode?

The show is on a super-rushed timeline now. Seven-episode season is fucking ridiculous.
Rugian
Member
Mon Jul 31 11:53:52
Hood:

"Careless" is leaving your door open do that people can catch you deep-dicking your sister. Child murder is not carelessness, it's monstrous. If you think that Jaime escapes moral culpability simply because there happen to be way bigger psychopaths on the show, then TV may have more of a desensitization effect than I realized.
Im better then you
2012 UP Football Champ
Mon Jul 31 12:03:32
"He's definitely become a better person since then,"

I suppose poisoning an old woman and taking her money is better than child murder but the guy is still an asshole.
hood
Member
Mon Jul 31 14:02:56
Rugian: careless as in quite literally without care, not absent minded.

And pushing Bran out the window is the only thing on him. Pretty much any non-stark has done plenty worse.

"I suppose poisoning an old woman and taking her money is better than child murder"

He's executing a traitor. Poison was the most dignified way for her to go. He could have dragged her to the red keep to be beheaded and have her head mounted.


"then TV may have more of a desensitization effect than I realized."

Or I'm just taking the events and analyzing them within the context of the show. Killing a child on GoT is barely a sin compared to the rest of the show. Killing a child on law and order, however, is a heinous crime. I can recognize both of these situations and discuss them within context.
obaminated
Member
Mon Jul 31 14:07:58
I don't mind the lack of filler in these episodes. And in the books euron is somewhat mystical. He claims to be the last storm when he kills his brother, during a storm and sneaks up on Yara during a cloudy night. So it could be that they'll touch on that mystical aspect at some point. Even if they don't, euron is a great and experienced sailor, so he would be able to sneak up on others.
CrownRoyal
Member
Mon Jul 31 14:13:56
good episode
Paramount
Member
Mon Jul 31 14:14:10
I knew Cersei and Jaime would try to make another baby. Cersei basically jumped onto her brother's dick and gave him a blow job, and then they had sex in the bed.

But she doesn't seem to care anymore if anyone finds out. Why is that?
obaminated
Member
Mon Jul 31 14:14:12
Also, the hound killed a boy in season 1 and after his redemption arc we are on his side. Jaime is the same way. He has undergone a redemption arc, whatever happens to him isn't going to be related to crippling Bran.
obaminated
Member
Mon Jul 31 14:15:11
Because she is the queen. Incest was common with Targs.
CrownRoyal
Member
Mon Jul 31 14:23:29
"That old Tyrell hag has stones"

If she really had stones, she would have told Jamie about killing Joffrey BEFORE taking the painless poison.
hood
Member
Mon Jul 31 14:33:11
I didn't say she had the biggest stones. But that smug look on her face, the deadset knowledge that Jaime wouldn't bother doing anything to her after she told him. Stones.
Cherub Cow
Member
Mon Jul 31 16:46:26
[Rugian]: "And as Alex Jones would point out, the fact that the viewing audience is actively siding with the banks and despots against a genuine champion of the common people just goes to show how deeply you mindless peons have accepted your conditioning. WAKE UP SHEEPLE"

Again, it was not siding with the banks and Cersei so much as siding against Pope Francis — who was *not* a champion of the common people. High Sparrow was near-overtly using his "man of the people" *façade* as a way to gain power in order to exploit the people. He was happy to manipulate Cersei into arming the sparrows, he sought out high-profile targets in order to gain power in the public spectacle, and he actively sought to destroy the old houses not because it would be good for the kingdom but because he liked having power over the rich (as shown by his smiling the most when he succeeded in harming the nobles or when he was given more power and authority). His end-goal was more strong-arm tyranny, the difference being only that *he* would be in charge and would replace noble tyranny with religious tyranny — a metaphor for the Catholic Church's rise. Cersei just happened to be the person who was not afraid to exercise her will against another would-be tyrant, so when she smiles as they die, audiences get to be satisfied not because Cersei's end-goal is some great thing but because audiences want to see an A-Team plan come together and want to see a liar like the High Sparrow killed, whereas at least Cersei is an honest tyrant. And further still, this isn't a two-party system: just because the High Sparrow sucks worse does not mean that Cersei gets to remain in power.

...
[Aeros]: "You can tell we are no longer in the areas where Martin has written ... Definitely lacks Martin's flare for the dramatic turnabout."

I think we're in the very strictest guidelines of what Martin has written. Given that the show has continued using classical references and historical analogs, this is probably Martin's exact outlines with episode-to-episode dialogue sprinkled on top. The "dramatic turnabout" has even still been used, though there may be some desensitization about it. For instance, Tyrion's big plan would have made fans pretty happy if it had been successful, but instead his plan falls apart when Euron surprises Yara's fleet instead of Yara laying siege to King's Landing and when Jaime sacs Highgarden (securing the biggest food stores in the 7 Kingdoms) instead of the Unsullied having a great victory at Casterly Rock. Danny the hero was all set for a great conquest, but instead she's suffering a momentum shift and getting a dose of reality, fighting as she is opponents that don't stand still.

Obviously we'll have to wait and see how the show ends up comparing to Martin's next book, but I expect the major details will remain the same. Still, the show changed details to surprise book-readers, and Martin may now have to change details to surprise show-watchers.

..
[hood]: "careless as in quite literally without care, not absent minded."

"Carefree" might have fit better, since "careless" implies negligence ;p

..
[Paramount]: "But she doesn't seem to care anymore if anyone finds out. Why is that?"
[obaminated]: "Because she is the queen."

Yeah Cersei outright said this. She's had to hide their relationship, but what's the point of having the highest title in the kingdom if she can't get some perks out of it?
Renzo Marquez
Member
Mon Jul 31 17:42:16
Rugian
Member Mon Jul 31 09:35:09
"Also, I found it amusing that the only person who has been happy with Cersei nuking the Faith Militant so far is a banker who holds slaving interests and engaged in wartime speculation by financing both sides of the conflict."

(((Iron Bank)))
Renzo Marquez
Member
Mon Jul 31 18:09:14
Disappointing that they deleted the scene of Bran getting vaccinated.
Paramount
Member
Mon Jul 31 18:15:59
I read some hackers hacked HBO and are now leaking spoilers on the internet.

Maybe its best to stay off internet a couple of months until this season is finished.
hood
Member
Mon Jul 31 18:32:46
""Carefree" might have fit better, since "careless" implies negligence ;p"

Fair enough. ;p
obaminated
Member
Mon Jul 31 18:34:12
Yeah guys don't seek the treasure. It's all been posted. And now I feel like bran. Knowing everything is not fun
Cherub Cow
Member
Mon Jul 31 19:04:23
Oh wow. The leak is a real thing :|
..k... time to avoid the Internet for 4 Sundays ;)
Forwyn
Member
Mon Jul 31 23:27:49
So Dr. Branhattan is pretty fucking tactless.
Billah
Member
Sat Aug 05 18:50:47
Grey Worm don't die.

I really like the beginning of the episode where Bronn asks Jaime, "Queen of thorns give ya one last prick in the balls before saying good bye"? Lol soo savage.

Bravos bank gets all the cash from High Garden. I guess Mycroft Holmes runs Bravos as well as the British Empire. Dude is waay smarter than Sherlock.

Bran seriously needs a medical doctor "Im not reall Bran anymore I'm the three eyed raven". What nonsense.

I really dont understand why Bran gets a huge welcome to Winterfell and then Arya gets treated like shite when she tries to stroll in. Her and Sanza meeting up again is nice.

Bran gave Littlefingers sweet Valyrian steel dagger to Arya. Now all the Starks know about Aryas list. Shes gonna run outta names soon. Cersei gonna get it.

Lolol finaaally Brienne say's "Thank you Podrick" she gonna get that Podridick soon dont forget he left all them high class hoes allll tired. Dude knows how to D down for sure.

And what is up with Jon and Daenarys looking at the Native American petroglyphs? Sooo romantic. But the petroglyphs are lit af and they depict the Children of the Forest fighting alongside Humans against the ice zombies. I guess humans killed them all off after that. Typical. Children of the Forest = Native Americans. Also im pretty sure in the petroglyphs I spotted a vagina a swastika and a dick. John gonna bend dat knee. I was really hoping he would kill reek when he shows up to dragon island but nooo, fricken goody two shoes. Reek needs to die already. Seeing him offends me and he is turning into reek again.

The way that Arya schools Brienne of Tarth at sword fighting is really something to see. And who'd have thought that Samwell Tarley was way more experienced at war than his brother who gets to be lord?

And seeing the Lannisters get ambushed and completely wrecked by Dothraki and Daenarys and her dragon is something I been waiting to see for years. Geez the Dothraki about to lay the smack down on all of Westeros like the Mongols rolled everyone. Jaime Lannister is a pos but he is just braver than Grey worm. Seriously? charging a dragon on a horse? Crazy af. Hopefully he cuts his armor off before the next episode.
CrownRoyal
Member
Mon Aug 07 20:11:05
why did Daenerys only took one dragon with her and not all three?
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