Utopia Talk / Politics / (OT) Dilemma

Paramount Member	Fri Jun 09 05:58:20 I'm about to purchase a new computer and I'm looking at two options. 1. The new iMac with a 5k 27" display 4,2 GHz Intel Core i7 Radeon Pro 575, 4 GB 32 gb ram 512 gb ssd 2. PC with similar specs But no 5k display But with a better graphic card: MSI GTX 1070 Gaming X, 8 gb The reason for picking the iMac (apart from OS X) is the 5k display. It would be great when I work with my photograps in Photoshop and Lightroom. The reason for picking the PC is obvious. For gaming. It is also a whole lot cheaper. I can also work with Photoshop and Lightroom on the PC. But I would not have the 5k display :( I would keep my current display instead. But I don't game as much anymore. The PS4 could still my gaming needs, maybe. But I know that when Elder Scroll 6 is released, or some other cool game, I may want to play it on a PC. What should I do?
Average Ameriacn Member	Fri Jun 09 06:00:39 Work harder, earn more money, buy both.
Paramount Member	Fri Jun 09 06:33:56 I would like to buy both. Man, what a dream that would be. I wish I could earn more moneys. Maybe if I stop paying the taxes like the rich does, then I could buy both.
Paramount Member	Fri Jun 09 07:20:55 But the question is, how much do I want to game the coming 5-7 years? Can I live without a PC? Or can I live without an iMac?
Rugian Member	Fri Jun 09 08:09:01 I've yet to see any pirn site that offers better than 4k resolution, so 5k is overkill. Option B.
Rugian Member	Fri Jun 09 08:09:26 Stupid autocorrect. Bit you know what I meant.
murder Member	Fri Jun 09 11:58:30 Do you really need 5k? Is that worth paying the Apple tax?
Nimatzo iChihuaha	Fri Jun 09 12:04:10 Bit I don't understate Rugian! I don't understate at all!
obaminated Member	Fri Jun 09 13:19:50 If you don't use your computer for gaming anymore (I don't, I just use it to write/work and web browse) why not just get a regular relatively cheap laptop? If I game it's on Xbox. If I wanna watch netflix/youtube/whatever streaming I use roku on my tv. My laptop really is just a tool for work and not recreation these days.
obaminated Member	Fri Jun 09 13:20:32 And even there my tablet tends to be more convenient with a better battery life.
Paramount Member	Fri Jun 09 13:27:57 Not sure if I really need 5k, but do I want it? Yes :) When I work with my photos in Lightroom, I think the 5k display will be the best. I'm not a pro photographer though, just a guy with a camera. I also just realized that I can install bootcamp on the iMac and then run Windows on a partition. So I can have both OS X and Windows. Which means that I can play Elder Scrolls 6 when it is released, on a 5k display! OS X and Windows! I will be eating the cake while still having it!! The screen looks so sexy it is almost like porn itself. 4k videos are coming more and more now. The iphone can record in 4k, I think. Iphone 8 will for sure. And in a year or so there will be a whole bunch teenage girls and women who will make home made videos of themselves and upload them to the internet, and when they do I will be ready with my 5k display. OS X, Windows 10, 5K display, 4K porn. All of it in this iMac 27". I think it is worth the Apple tax. Maybe.
obaminated Member	Fri Jun 09 13:30:44 Wow, you really are a cuck.
Paramount Member	Fri Jun 09 13:37:20 obaminated Member Fri Jun 09 13:19:50 If you don't use your computer for gaming anymore (I don't, I just use it to write/work and web browse) why not just get a regular relatively cheap laptop -- I already have Macbook Pro. The reason why I want a desktop at home is to be able to work with photographs on a large screen. I can of course connect my laptop to a bigger screen. So yeah I could just buy a new large screen. But ... I kinda want that 5k iMac, or a gaming PC. But as I just said, I can run bootcamp on OS X and then I can play Windows games on the iMac. I just need to get the iMac that comes with the 8 GB GPU instead of 4 GB.
murder Member	Fri Jun 09 16:36:25 "Not sure if I really need 5k, but do I want it? Yes :) When I work with my photos in Lightroom, I think the 5k display will be the best. I'm not a pro photographer though, just a guy with a camera." Go with the iMac if you can afford it. :o)
obaminated Member	Fri Jun 09 18:30:11 I recant my insult, paramount.
Hrothgar Member	Fri Jun 09 19:52:40 Really there is no "better" option here. Both are good options. It just depends on what you want most. Gaming rig or "just works more secure" technology tool.
Dukhat Member	Sat Jun 10 00:58:50 LoL. Who cares about 5k? It's not like a Radeon 575 could power that many pixels for gaming anyways. You'd also probably have to use windowed mode in order for a 4k image be 1-to-1 to edit porperly. For games, you'd probably be playing at 1080p or 1440p (2k) and then having the monitor's built-in scaler upsample it. If you want to edit movies and videos ultrawides are where it's at. I have a 1440p ultrawide as my main monitor for productivity and it's great for games too especially old-man turn-based strategy games that I prefer now to the hardcore stuff. If you need 4k for videos, just get a decent dell 4k monitor for a few hundred instead. If you really love macs, for the love of good don't get an iMac. I suggest getting a 2015 Macbook Pro (before they started being thin for no reason and removed all the useful ports). You can also get the new one if you want; it has a much better graphics card but you have to carry dongles. You can dock it to use for work at home and also have a decent work computer on the road as well for on-the-fly camera editing. It won't have a good graphics card but it's enough for light gaming. You can also get a thunderbolt-connected external GPU to connect to the macbook pro to "upgrade it" and then have that GPU connected to a monitor. It's somewhat expensive currently but at least you have the option. Pretty sure you can't with the iMac. I would add the options below: 3) Macbook Pro w/ nice LG/Dell 4k Monitor when docked. Good for camera work on the fly. Powerful enough for light gaming. Spend about the same, but get more productivity. And also modify the 2nd option: 2) A PC with much better specs in a Radeon 1700 (since you will do editing) and GTX 1070 and MULTIPLE monitors. Save $$$$. I'd just go either 2 or 3 and not care so much about 5k. In fact, I am both 2 and 3 since I have a macbook pro and a nice gaming pc and like 3 monitors and a projector.
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 10 02:20:27 I'm having a second thought on the iMac 5k 27". Did some calculating and dayum that shit is expensive if I'm going to max out the specs on it. I could get one-and-a-half PC for a similar price. "For games, you'd probably be playing at 1080p or 1440p (2k) and then having the monitor's built-in scaler upsample it. " Yes, I read up a little and I would be gaming at 1080p or 1440p. "If you need 4k for videos, just get a decent dell 4k monitor for a few hundred instead." I read that there is a Dell 5k monitor, but also that it cost as much as an iMac. But yes I can always get a 4k monitor. "You can also get a thunderbolt-connected external GPU to connect to the macbook pro to "upgrade it" and then have that GPU connected to a monitor. It's somewhat expensive currently but at least you have the option. Pretty sure you can't with the iMac." I read that you can do it on the iMac with the new High Sierra OS. But if I want a gaming machine I should probably just stick to PC instead, and not try to turn the iMac into a gaming machine, because it would only be mediocre and at a very high cost.
jergul large member	Sat Jun 10 05:01:18 A PC that you can and will upgrade has an life expectancy of 8 years before not worth upgrading and becoming obsolete. A laptop has 2.5 years A mac is somewhere in between. Say 4 years. Mac cost per year is something like 3 times as expensive as a PC.
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 10 06:11:40 Please don't say that, Jergul. I had like almost decided to go for an iMac, but now you are giving me second thoughts again. Say something positive about the iMac intead.
jergul large member	Sat Jun 10 06:40:00 Its fire and forget. You save yourself thinking about upgrading it. It will become obsolete at some point. You replace it when it does.
jergul large member	Sat Jun 10 06:41:11 imac is fine if you don't enjoy tracking down components for fun and amusement.
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 10 06:49:18 I just need to work harder and earn more, then I can buy a new iMac in 4 years :) What do you think about this PC, Jergul? http://www...ilent-gamer-premium#!tab:extra Except that I will get 32 GB RAM instead and maybe this Motherboard: http://www.komplett.se/product/909946/datorutrustning/pc-komponenter/moderkort/intel-socket/asus-strix-z270e-gaming-socket-1151 instead of the MSI Z270 Tomahawk. This PC will cost about 20500 SEK. That's about 10000 SEK less than the iMac.
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 10 06:52:28 But with the iMac I get a superior 5k display for those 10000 SEK. That is something to consider.
jergul large member	Sat Jun 10 06:57:21 Give me a moment and I will save you 10k. A moment later: ASUS GeForce GTX 1060 6GB Strix Gaming ASUS ROG Strix Z270E Gaming, Socket-1151 Crucial Ballistix Elite DDR4 16GB Phanteks Enthoo EVOLV ATX GLASS Intel Core i5-7600K Kaby Lake Prosessor Corsair RM650x 650W PSU Corsair Force MP500 240GB M.2 PCIe SSD NZXT Kraken X62 CPU Kjøler
jergul large member	Sat Jun 10 06:58:58 That should clock in at about 15k. So 5k, but still.
jergul large member	Sat Jun 10 07:01:50 (Very good mb choice btw. You may have a natural talent for this kind of thing).
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 10 07:20:57 Hm.. why do you pick that build? Why i5 instead of i7? Why 16 gb ram instead of 32? And what about the Phanteks Enthoo EVOLV ATX GLASS? Is it good? Silent? The reason I picked the "Silent gamer" is because I want the PC to be silent. The Fractal Design R5 is supposed to be silent. The GPU MSI GTX 1070 has some kind of TWIN FROZR technique which helps to keep it silent, they say. Not sure about the motherboards. Does the motherboard and the GPU have to be of the same brand? Are there any advantages if they both are from ASUS or MSI? Any disadvantage of having an ASUS motherboard and a MSI GPU? Gonna run into town now to look at a 27" iMac. Not buying it yet. Just wanna look at it and touch it.
jergul large member	Sat Jun 10 07:39:56 Its a very good build. i5 instead of i7 and a good cooling solution. Its an oc build (the mb is set up for oc - as are most gaming mbs). i7 is overkill in my opinion. 16 gb is 2x8. If you need 32, then buy it when you see the need. The mb has 4 slots (I doubt you will need it). Same producer, same series gpu and motherboard. There are advantages. You will notice it mainly on the software side, but same series gpu and mb avoids unintended bottlenecks that can occur with mix and match. This is a pro mac argument too incidentally. Tempered glass is all the rage. For good reason. You should check out: Corsair Force MP500 240GB M.2 PCIe SSD. A brilliant thing. My only concern with the build is that we are transitioning to usb C (which is supposed to be futureproof), but mbs and cases are not quite there yet. It would be better to wait until usb c is more in place.
Dukhat Member	Sat Jun 10 09:22:15 Jergul's build doesn't match Paramount's needs. "Why i5 instead of i7?" Paramount is doing video and photo editing. He needs an i7. "Why 16 gb ram instead of 32?" See above. "The reason I picked the "Silent gamer" is because I want the PC to be silent. The Fractal Design R5 is supposed to be silent." Fractal makes the best cases IMO but any pc will get loud when it's under load. Can't change the laws of physics. "Not sure about the motherboards. Does the motherboard and the GPU have to be of the same brand?" It doesn't matter what brand. The only thing that really matters on motherboards is the number of VRM power phases (more = better overclocking), maybe more fan headers if you want to have your system quiet (the motherboard will help sync fans to CPU temps), and connectivity (more USB on a stable bus). Some of Jergul's other points don't make snese. Corsair's SSD isn't as good as Samsung's 960 line. Samsung smashes the competition. USB-C is available on most z270 motherboards along with a USB-C frontheader. ************************************************ Looking at your choices on the custom you listed, I agree with all of them. You really picked the best value component for each part. Looks like you have to buy a monitor with that build too so it starts to match the imac. The iMac's not such a bad deal because of the 5k monitor being built in. Not too bad really. And Macs have high resell value anyways. Just go with whatever makes you happy. Warning: 5k porn is great. You can see all the zits and worts and crow's feet.
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 10 09:46:44 Okay thanks. I have kinda decided not to buy an iMac. While the display is super nice and all, in a few years the computer itself will be outdated and then the screen will be kinda useless. I think it's probably better to go with a PC. Get a good case that will last me 8-10 years, and then update the components whenever I feel to. The best thing with a PC is that it is cheaper, upgradeable, I can play games on it, I can work with Adobe CC on it. Yes it would make sense that the i5 produces less heat, which in turn will make the system a bit more silent. Maybe it is overkill with i7 and 32 mb ram. But I kinda like to overkill. Somehow I feel better knowing that my PC has some serious power in it. I could run any game I want at the highest settings. Wouldn't more ram and a faster processor make the computer handle RAW files better/faster in Photoshop and Lightroom for an example? The ASUS ROG STRIX Z270E GAMING has one USB 3.1 Type C-contact. That's one at least, but maybe it will not be enough? How long would I have to wait until mbs and cases are there with support for usb-c? What is oc? Off-cooling? Onboard-cooling? "You should check out: Corsair Force MP500 240GB M.2 PCIe SSD" I see that it has a fast read/write speed. But isn't 240gb kinda small? I need Windows 10, Photoshop CC, Lightroom CC, and some other programs, and a few games on it too. I found two Samsung M.2 SSD, with 500 gb and similar read/write speed. "Tempered glass is all the rage. For good reason." Does it help to cool it down? The most important thing for me is that the PC has to be silent. Well, as silent as possible.
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 10 09:47:52 "Paramount is doing video and photo editing" Mostly photo editing. Not video so much.
jergul large member	Sat Jun 10 10:21:02 Dukhat I am working off para's description of need + how I know him. There are cases where you might need i7 and 32 ram, but that would be game streaming creation/144 Mhz online fps on 4k or better/futuresafe VR preparation (and then a better GPU is also required)/benchmark test bragrights. Para It is overkill for anything not listed above. You can play anything you can imagine on their highest settings. You will not have lag or any form of productivity effecting issues with the build. So not better, and not faster by any measure you might notice. OC means overclocking (or having the processor/gpu do more calculations per second than factory standard). Its actually pretty standard fare these days and has no competency requirements. You use the software and press a button. Silence is a function of cooling needs (how much heat you need to dump) and fan quality. I have a marginal preference for watercooling (good water cooling) ahead of Noctua variants. The build will be as quite as you need (the psu is the noisiest component, hence it being a class better than the rest of the stuff). I can only imagine noise being noticable on ultrahigh game settings or if you start mucking about with VR. If in doubt, then go with a better gpu (asus strix 1070). The 1060 would be the first thing to make a racket. But nothing you can do will even approach the noise a laptop makes when you stress it. And when doing stressing stuff, you will have audio on anyway. So the sound wont be noticable. Glass does help cool it down. A quiet case is insulated. Which locks in heat (and sound) Glass is a good insulator, but does not hold much heat. The major advantage beyond aestetiques is the case being well designed and easy to inspect so you dust if often. It also will encourage you to do the cabling properely so it looks nice. It should look spectacular when on. Several of the components have programmable lighting. For storage, I would go for 2xHDDs in raid configuration. HDDs give warning before catastrophic failure. Still, do the cloud save of vital documents.
jergul large member	Sat Jun 10 10:23:54 On usb c. I would have thought it industrial standard already, so cannot wager a guess.
jergul large member	Sat Jun 10 10:33:24 To put it this way: My current gaming PC is a three years old variant of the build I gave. My daughter has an xbox one. She plays overwatch on both, and vastly prefere using my PC. It seriously outperforms the xbox one, and makes no noise at ultra settings (the psu is by far the noisiest component). With that said. The feelgood factor is important. But feeling good is the only real reason for going with i7 and 32 gig ram. I would go with a better gpu way before and upgrade to the other stuff.
Dukhat Member	Sat Jun 10 13:38:27 "Yes it would make sense that the i5 produces less heat, which in turn will make the system a bit more silent. " An i5 and i7 are basically the same chip but one is "locked" to 4 threads by Intel and the other has 8 threads. The i7 is binned better so it will probably overclock higher. If you run both at the same speed, they will generate almost the same amount of heat. The i7 at least gives you the option to go faster. I'll go with the i7 because it is more future-proof for games. Many games are ported to PS4/XB1 now and the home consoles have an 8-core chip inside (albeit much slower than an Intel) so you need 8 threads in the near-future to game. "Maybe it is overkill with i7 and 32 mb ram. But I kinda like to overkill." Well if Jergul's right and you're only doing photo editing, don't go above 16gb of ram. It's more for video editing. Games run fine on 8 gb of ram, maybe a little more. There is a large ram shortage right now so ram prices are 40%+ higher from 6 months ago. I'd just get 16gb (8x2) and wait until it gets cheaper to upgrade. "The ASUS ROG STRIX Z270E GAMING has one USB 3.1 Type C-contact. That's one at least, but maybe it will not be enough?" One is enough for now. There are not many peripherals that use it. There's something called USB 3.1 header on a motherboard. Basically it is a slot where you connect it to your case and it lets you use usb-c connectors on your case or with a front panel like this: https://goo.gl/EDhYAB. Newer cases should have USB-C. I think 1 USB-C on the board and 2 in front should be fine for the near future. "I see that it has a fast read/write speed. But isn't 240gb kinda small?" Your first choice of a Samsung PM961 500gb was solid. It's slightly slower than the current evo 960 but you'll never notice and it is cheaper. It's also faster than basically anything else out there not from Samsung. "The most important thing for me is that the PC has to be silent. Well, as silent as possible." You'll want 2 things: Good airflow and a decent number of fan connectors on your motherboard. If you have bad airflow, your computer will get hot no matter what and be loud. With fan connectors on the motherboard, every case fan will be connected to your motherboard's sensors. When you use the CPU heavily it will speed up your fans and your computer will get loud (can't be helped). If you're not doing anything other than photo-editing or browsing, it will be very quiet as your system won't be generating any heat and the fans will spin slowly.
Dukhat Member	Sat Jun 10 13:39:02 Most of jergul's new points are right. I do think only an i5 is not very future proof though for gaming. I see benefits in almost every game from the last year with an i7 vs my old i5.
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 10 18:27:16 Thanks for all the info. I'll consider going with 16 gb ram then, to start with. I can upgrade later if I notice that it isn't enough. I'll pick the ASUS Z270E motherboard and the ASUS 1070 graphic card. But the MSI Gaming M5 or M7 looks good too, together with MSI 1070 Gaming X. I'm gonna look around a bit more and see if there are any better or newer models of cases. The Fractal Design R5 is nice but it has a few years on its neck, doesn't it? Maybe it isn't optimal to use together with the ASUS Z270E motherboard. For storage, I've been thinking about getting a Drobo eventually. In a year or so. If they are any good. Or I might just buy single cases for my harddrives and stack them on top of each other, or something. I'm curious how the GPU in the iMac 27", the Radeon Pro 580 with 8GB vram, compares to a GTX 1060 or 1070 card. I might wanna wait to buy something until someone has done some testing and reviews of it.
jergul large member	Sat Jun 10 19:19:15 Para You will see what I mean about usb c when you start looking around for mother boards. You will not find a wide selection just yet.
jergul large member	Sat Jun 10 20:10:36 Looking around for cases I meant*
Cthulhu Tentacle Rapist	Sat Jun 10 21:21:32 You do know you can get 5k display for pc, right?
Dukhat Member	Sat Jun 10 22:06:56 http://www...ews/MSI/GTX_1060_Armor/30.html Rx 480/580 =~ GTX 1060 =~ GTX 980 GTX 1070 is about 30% faster. GTX 1080 TI is about 60% faster on top of that.
Paramount Member	Sun Jun 11 02:17:11 Jergul, On the iMac 27" there are two Thunderbolt 3 (usb-c) ports on the back of the monitor :) So maybe I should go for the iMac anyway? If the GPU equals to a GTX 1060/980 then I could play some games on it at the least, for an example Elder Scrolls 6 when it is released? My priority on a desktop computer isn't gaming, but Photoshop/Lightroom, internet, etc. If I can game on it, it is a plus of course.
Paramount Member	Sun Jun 11 02:26:41 For Photoshop/Lightroom, internet, etc. The iMac could probably last me 8 years or something, right? Or am I being optimistic?
Paramount Member	Sun Jun 11 02:38:19 With two Thunderbolt 3 (usb-c) ports on the back of the iMac I could use an external GPU in the future, I think. Can I?
hood Member	Sun Jun 11 03:39:51 The GTX 1060 with 6 gb ram (not the 3gb version, mind you) is ridiculous value right now. If you're buying a video card and you don't want top of the line (1080), get the 1060.
jergul large member	Sun Jun 11 05:16:17 Para You would be buying the imac to feel good about it. There is not way you are going to feel good about a 8 year, or even a 6 year old mac. I would say 4 year. Hood Yepp.
Paramount Member	Sun Jun 11 05:52:30 "You would be buying the imac to feel good about it" Definitely. The same way as I would buy a PC with overkill specs. To feel good about it :) If a PC with a i7, 32gb ram, gtx 1070 8gb vram, 512 gb ssd, is overkill (meaning it will last me many many years?), then an iMac with a i7, 32gb ram, Radeon Pro 580 8gb vram, 512gb ssd, is also overkill and will last me many years? "There is not way you are going to feel good about a 8 year, or even a 6 year old mac. I would say 4 year." You are probably right. Because in 1-2 years from now Apple will release a new model of the iMac - the 2018/2019 model, and then I'm going to crave that one. So in 4 years, they will have released two or three new models of the iMac. But will there be major upgrades to it? Or only minor "meh" upgrades? I think you can probably jump over one or two generations. But yeah, in 4 years I will probably want to upgrade to have the latest technology/specs. I have had my current desktop PC since 2009 (8 years) and I can still use it for Photoshop CC and Lightroom CC, and some gaming. But... Lightroom crashes sometimes due to lack of RAM. The only thing I have upgraded during these 8 years is the system harddrive, to a SSD. Sure I can upgrade the RAM to 16gb. But... I don't know. It would be nice with a completely new desktop computer and screen. A PC or Mac. What I love about the iMac is the display. What I love about the PC is that it cost less and I will be able to play games on it too, if I want to. But I'm not sure that I will spend any time playing any games. Except maybe for Elder Srolls 6 or something. But I could play that shit on my PS4, like a boss.
Paramount Member	Mon Jun 12 12:09:38 So I chatted with Apple today and asked them what the read/write speed of their SSD on the iMac 27" is. After a long wait, the person I was chatting with had to investigate and talk with some "tech guy" or something, the person then returned after like 15 minutes and said Sorry I'm not able to find the specification of the SSD. But it is 50% faster than the previous iMac model. I asked if the person could give me the name of the model of the SSD so I can try to find out the read/write speed of it myself. The person then said they can't say what model it is. The only thing they can say is that it is a SSD. A bit frustrating. Would you buy a car from a car salesman if he wouldn't tell you what the max speed of it is, or what model/name it is? Buying from Apple is like buying the pig in the sack.
murder Member	Mon Jun 12 12:30:01 Pig in a poke.
Asgard Member	Mon Jun 12 15:31:09 "I recant my insult, paramount." Shame.
Turtle Crawler Admin	Tue Jun 13 12:52:20 You can simply buy the monitor for the PC. I'm planning to do this for my next box.
Turtle Crawler Admin	Tue Jun 13 12:56:08 http://www...-27-Inch-LED-Lit/dp/B00OKSFXZU
Paramount Member	Thu Jun 15 14:32:14 Yeah, I could get a 4k or 5k monitor dor the PC. But I have read that Windows does not display text as sharp as Mac OS does. Mac OS is simply better at displaying text. That is what I have read anyway. I have not made or seen a comparison myself. But yes, it's an alternative.
Paramount Member	Thu Jun 15 14:41:54 Has anyone got the new iPad Pro 10.5" yet? Damn that thing looks nice. I'm still using my iPad Air. Don't remember when I bought this, but in 2013 maybe? So its 4 years old now, and I want to upgrade it to the new iPad Pro! Man, it looks like Apple is gonna get all my moneys. I want that 27" 5k iMac, i7, 8 gb ram (gonna update ram to 16-32 gb myself later), 512 gb ssd, Radeon Pro 570 4 gb vram or Radeon Pro 580 8 gb vram. I also want that iPad Pro 10.5" Apple Pencil Apple smart keyboard ... and the Apple TV (4th gen) with 32 gb. But damn, its gonna cost me lots of money :( They should give me the Apple Pencil for free.
Paramount Member	Thu Jun 15 14:43:42 Correcrion: Radeon Pro 575, not 570
Paramount Member	Thu Jun 15 14:44:05 *correction
State Department Member	Thu Jun 15 18:11:32 "Would you buy a car from a car salesman if he wouldn't tell you what the max speed of it is, or what model/name it is?" No, but it looks like you're going to.
murder Member	Sat Jun 17 09:33:51 "But damn, its gonna cost me lots of money :( They should give me the Apple Pencil for free." You realize that you're going to end up spending double for all that stuff, just for the Apple logo, right? It's OK to splurge for something that you really want from time to time, but now you sound you have some Apple fixation. Buy Windows/Android based products and send your kid to college instead. :o)
Asgard Member	Sat Jun 17 10:47:11 I think College is free is Sweden
Dukhat Member	Sat Jun 17 11:05:26 I remember when I got the Macbook Pro when it first launched. It was so much better than the other laptops out there I didn't mind the premium I had paid. But nowadays, everyone's caught up. The new macbook pro is kind of a joke. It's glorified macbook air. And the iMac is meh. 5k isn't really necessary for anything. Nore is 4k really. And Siri is the worst of all the voice apps out there. Alexa and Google voice is much better. So apple creates nice stuff but they aren't so far ahead now to justify the price difference.
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 17 11:46:10 Have you seen the Microsft Surface Studio? Its a giant touch screen with a built in computer, and you can tilt it! and use a pencil to draw on it. Its almost like Microsoft has become more innovative than Apple. But I wonder what the refresh rate of that screen is, though. And Misrosoft's pencil is probably not as good as Apple's pencil for the iPad Pro.
murder Member	Sat Jun 17 11:59:59 "I think College is free is Sweden" I meant a good one ... in the US. ;o)
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 17 12:00:34 Murder, "You realize that you're going to end up spending double for all that stuff, just for the Apple logo, right?" Yup, that's why I haven't decided yet what to do yet. But yes I have a Apple fixation right kow. I might not get the iMac but I know it would look good on my desk. What I'm pretty sure that I buy though, is the iPad Pro 10.5" with a pencil and smart keyboard, and the Apple TV. I need more time to decide on whether to buy a Mac or PC desktop. Maybe I will wait until later this year and see what Apple will do with their Mac mini line, if they will update their Mac minis or not.
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 17 12:01:50 Damn typos everywhere.
murder Member	Sat Jun 17 12:04:31 "But nowadays, everyone's caught up." Steve Jobs ... still dead.
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 17 12:49:32 Finally someone has posted a proper review of the 2017 iMac 5k. http://youtu.be/F0ZOqg8JjsE Instead of just unboxing and reading the specs, this guy is actually testing it. He tests games and Adobe Premiere on it, etc. I know this iMac is overpriced but I want it.
murder Member	Sat Jun 17 13:01:28 This may be the longest running drama in Sweden. :o)
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 17 13:03:34 lol
Paramount Member	Sat Jun 17 13:04:10 Microsoft Surface Studio VS iMac! http://youtu.be/68rR4mVzerw
murder Member	Sat Jun 17 13:26:03 I want the Microsoft Surface Studio. lol :o)
jergul large member	Sat Jun 17 13:56:51 Para I take it as a given that the imac will be show cased in your livingroom. That is an argument in favour of getting it for the decorative bling factor.
Paramount Member	Sun Jun 18 03:41:57 Yes, it will sit on my white very stylish IKEA desk in the living room, and I would use my photographs as a screen saver.
Nimatzo iChihuaha	Sun Jun 18 16:49:32 Just remember while you are nerd jerking over your soon to be bought techno gadget, that capitalism supplied you with the IKEA desk and the iMac. And capitalism is bad, because you hero Marx said so. Socialism, because I am too stupid to think for myself™
jergul large member	Mon Jun 19 01:10:46 Mixed model social democracy quite literally created the circumstances Para enjoys. For your libertarian dream - see Liberia for details.
Nimatzo iChihuaha	Mon Jun 19 01:20:57 Geography. Sweden (Norway too) and her model would have collapsed long ago without the landmass of Europe protecting her from all the poor and huddled masses of MENA. You 'member how quickly the border got shut when the rest of the EU allowed people to pass through? I 'member.
Paramount Member	Mon Jun 19 04:34:59 I can not decide whether to buy the iMac or not, or if I should go for the upgradeable PC instead. I can not decide! What if the iMac is very noisy? Not sure I could stand that.
Nimatzo iChihuaha	Mon Jun 19 06:13:48 There are no reasons to have an iMac, unless you are really devoted to the Apple eco system. You can buy a beautiful screen and just hide the tower in your living room, if that is what you are after. I built a top end PC, i7, GTX 1080 with CPU water cooling all the jazz. On 1080 resolution it is completely silent, max graphic settings on any top end game. I was actually surprised at how silent it was under "stress". At 4k I would expect things to be pushed to the limits and the fans would start spinning. You can buy soundproof tower, low noise fans etc. This is not difficult choice.
McKobb Member	Mon Jun 19 06:48:11 Qe will will turn any current architecture into an artifact in half a decade.
Paramount Member	Mon Jun 19 13:05:43 I hear you, but my priority is not gaming. But if the machine can game it is a plus of course. It's hard to find a beautiful 4k display with a IPS panel.
Nimatzo iChihuaha	Mon Jun 19 13:27:37 Ok sure, it is subjective, but there are 4k IPS displays that fit nicely in any living room. I had the same dilemma 2 computers ago.
Paramount Member	Mon Jun 19 13:47:52 I will buy a 5k monitor, just to beat you. So either the iMac, or a PC with Dell's 5k monitor.
Paramount Member	Mon Jun 19 14:00:26 I'm thinking: you only live once. So why not get an iMac. When the world is destroyed in the nuclear war and while people are killing each other on the streets, I will at the last end earth-life watching it all on a 5k iMac.
Dukhat Member	Mon Jun 19 14:57:33 You can compromise and buy a PC that is upgradeable (mostly) that emulates the iMac. It's called a Hackintosh. Look it up. Boot up OSX to do work. Boot up windows to game.
Nimatzo iChihuaha	Tue Jun 20 00:48:56 Whatever you do, don't hackintosh. Mixing the races is an abomination to God Emperor Jobs.
Paramount Member	Sun Jun 25 12:40:24 I was looking into LG's 4k monitor. The 27UD88. It looks sweet, and even has a USB-C port. I talked to Komplett.se and they said they no longer sell this monitor because there has been a lot of problem with it. :( So maybe I'll get an iMac anyways. Apple's 5k monitor is superb. But I will listen to Jergul's advice and go for the i5 processor instead of the i7. I have been reading some forums and people are complaining about loud fan noise on iMac with the i7-7700K CPU. Aparantly, its chip has a higher woltage (95 watt)? So the fan is more prone to kick in early. The question is if the 3.8 Mhz i5-7600K makes the fan kick as easily as the i7 does, or not? I think the i5-7600K also is a 95W CPU. So the i5-7600K probably makes the iMac as noisy as the i7 does? If that is the case, then I will go for the i5-7600. It is a 65W CPU if I understand everything correct. So the 3.5 Mhz i5-7600 should make the iMac more silent. The 3.5 Mhz i5-7600 should probably be sufficient for my needs. Lightroom, Photoshop, browsing the web, looking at movies, etc. I don't think I need i7's Hyper Threading for this. But the downside by going with the 3.5 mhz i5 iMac is that I won't get the Radeon Pro 580 with 8 GB vram. This iMac comes with the Radeon Pro 575 with 4 GB vram. Is this sufficient to run the 5K display without any lag? 8 GB VRAM would be sweet! I also found this review/test of Intel's new Kaby Lake CPU's. But this is like Greece to me. http://www...-i5-7600k-i5-7600,4870-11.html The only thing I understand is the conclusion of the i5-7600: "The most mainstream CPU in our line-up is also the most economical and efficient. That's not just because of our sample's quality, either. Rather, the Core i5-7600’s frequency range is a lot closer to the processor’s sweet spot. This makes the quad-core model ideal for applications that put a premium on minimizing waste heat. Consider it for small form factor builds or other environments with limited cooling capacity." ^Sounds like this is the CPU to go for with the iMac? Unless you are doing heavy video encoding and needs all the power you can get, but then you will also get a noisy computer?
Paramount Member	Mon Jun 26 14:56:47 Which is true? More power means less noise. Because it has the power to run things with no restraints. or Less power means less noise. Because less power produces less heat, which means that the fan does not need to kick in.
Dukhat Member	Mon Jun 26 17:50:32 More Power means more noise. Power = Heat = Faster/Louder Fans needed to dissipate. Even so, the slowest intel chips still will generate a lot of heat under load. So the noise will be substantial. As for your consideration of video cards. A 580 is mediocre. It is equivalent to an r9 290 or 390 Radeon of yore or a GTX 980 or GTX 1060. A 575 is closer to an r9 280 or GTX 970 or GTX 1050 TI. It will be ok for easy games like overwatch. More ram won't save it from being mediocre.
Paramount Member	Thu Jun 29 12:20:44 I have ordered the 2017 iMac 27" 5k. Despite almost everyone telling me to buy a PC instead :P I picked the i5 7600 3.5 Ghz (turbo boost 4.2 Ghz) 8 GB RAM (gonna add 16 or 32 GB later so I'll have 24 or 40 GB RAM) Radeon Pro 575 4 GB VRAM GPU 1 TB SSD So I picked the non-K version of the i5 processor, because it it's only 65W and will run cooler. It also means that I can't get the 580 GPU with 8 GB VRAM. Which is a bummer. But, I'm not buying this computer to play games. So I think the 575 with 4 GB VRAM will suffice. If not I can always get a eGPU because High Sierra will support it. I think this computer will be silent for what I intend to use it for. Photo editing in Lightroom and Photoshop, web surfing, youtube, etc. I have the iphone, the ipad, so it only makes sense to have the imac also.
Paramount Member	Wed Jul 05 10:53:10 I'm sitting with my iMac 27" 5K now... It is silent as a mouse! But so far I haven't really done anything that will push the processor to da max. I like Siri. I can talk to my computer, tell it to do things. I never used it on iPad or iPhone but I think I will use it on the iMac. I've got to order an additional 16 GB RAM, and two external hard drives, or some kind of storage solution where I will store all my photos on. Gonna install Adobe Creative Cloud and Photoshop CC and Lightroom CC soon. I'm gonna wait with installing Bootcamp/Windows 10 on this machine.
Hot Rod Revved Up	Wed Jul 05 12:23:37 I thought he was going to ask which shoe goes on the left foot.
murder Member	Wed Jul 05 12:29:21 "I'm sitting with my iMac 27" 5K now..." Holy shit! You dragged this out almost a month! :o)
Dukhat Member	Wed Jul 05 13:32:52 Siri is really bad ... It is the worst of all the voice assistants ...
Paramount Member	Wed Jul 05 13:40:12 "Holy shit! You dragged this out almost a month! :o) " Yeah, I had to read up a little bit, watch reviews on youtube, and then make the actual decision. "Siri is really bad ... It is the worst of all the voice assistants" Is Microsoft's Cortana better? I have never tried it.
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